The Columbus Dispatch has published four emails between the federal attorney working with Edward Rife, the Columbus tattoo shop owner named in the NCAA investigation of Ohio State, and Ohio State Coach Jim Tressel. Reading the emails, you can see why Coach Tressel said that he was “scared” when he was first alerted that some of his athletes had traded Ohio State memorabilia in exchange for tattoos. According to the attorney who contacted Tressel, not only was Rife facing serious drug charges, he was involved in a homicide (at least as a witness).
The emails make it quite clear that this was not a small time criminal they were dealing with. When Federal investigators raided Rife’s house, they seized $70,000 in cash along with a stash of Ohio State memorabilia. It is also important to note that the attorney stated that if Rife did purchase memorabilia from the Ohio State football players for, “not that much.”
Reading the emails, it also appears that the attorney was a concerned Ohio State fan and wanted to alert Tressel to the potential problem at hand — not because he was concerned about NCAA violations but because he was concerned about the Ohio State players associating with Rife. At one point, he tells Coach Tressel to make sure his players do not call Rife on his cell phone as the phone was going to be taken into evidence in the federal case against Rife.
Although the request for confidentiality did not come until the second email, it appears that the attorney took some risk in reaching out to Tressel as he had advised Rife on the situation. Although it was not clear if the attorney took Rife on as a client, contacting Tressel could have been a breach of client/attorney confidentiality.
Although I am admittedly biased, the emails do seem to support Coach Tressel’s version of events during last night’s press conference. The NCAA violation of the sale of items does not seem to be the main point of concern in the emails. The discussion is more along the lines that all Ohio State fans had when first hearing of the violations–how could they part with such treasured items? At one point, Tressel mentions that he is about to pass out the 2009 Big Ten Championship rings and “would like to hold some collateral.”
You can read the emails in there entirety here, here, here and here.
Update: Apparently not everyone at Ohio State thinks Tressel should stay. A student writer at The Lantern has lashed out saying that Tressel should, “Get the Boot.”
I also just read a _ichigan blog’s take on the story. Talk about a guy living in a world of hypocrisy. I’d pass along the link but I don’t want to give him the benefit of the link juice. I’ll leave the Google search to you.
{ 93 comments… read them below or add one }
Well, I’ve got a different take… but neither explain the decision not to talk with the General Council’s office.
Personally, I believe that Coach thought he could handle this on his own. And that’s the problem- no one person is bigger than the team.
Oh yea.. he even agreed that he could have handled it better, but I do believe as most of us probably do, he did not take the course that he did to protect wins on the field, but off the field.
I truly believe that Coach Tress has higher priorities than football wins and that is why he will be here for as long as he wishes.
I think you’re right on target Mali. He thought he could handle this on his own while in reality, was in way over his head.
You may be biased, but people who don’t know what life is like outside the four walls of their parents’ basement knows what his position is like either.
I read the Lantern article… can we borrow Bobby Knight for a little while?
I’d like to see him that the sh!thead by the throat and choke him out.
He’s pretty much echoing the rest of the “fire Tressel” articles out there.
I understand the sentiment coming from the outside.. but from the inside?? I’m betting he got beat up a lot as a kid.
Funny, when Michigan was under investigation every buckeye said major infractions did occur without hearing the facts. And look how that investigation turned out. I guess that is how we as people are, guilty, if it doesn’t fit your agenda. I read the article (I will with hold the link also) and there is nothing that is out of ordinary. This is all well documented. If it is not true, refute it. Otherwise, don’t call the person a hypocrite because it doesn’t fit your agenda. Is the article from the Columbus Dispatch wrong? Although I am not a buckeye, my wife and in-laws are and they want Tess out for making the university look bad. To me, he should stay until the NCAA concludes it investigation, if they come back. If not he should stay.
If I wanted to get into a pissing match over said article, I would. I didn’t reference the article because this is obviously not the time to cast stones. (That and the fact that I don’t want to promote it.)
I agree that “agendas” are playing a bigger and bigger role in what has become sports writing these days. I also understand my role as a blogger running a Ohio State fansite (note my tag line). An agenda, no. A biased opinion, definitely.
Of course, I could be talking about of a number of blog posts written by the Michigan bloggers — some of which are pretty good, some are to be expected.
I did read the Michigan blogs talking about sports journalism and agendas (forget which at the moment). Good article. I’d give that one the link.
A good response. Thank you. Not trying to get into a pissing match. And I will leave it at that.
From an impartial point of view its much more easier to believe Jim kept quiet because the players were involved were most likely(not proven yet) the starting QB and his friends, thus ruining the season.
And he was scared of a tattoo shop owner with some cash in his house???????? Come on man, what was he afraid of? The tat guy was ALREADY in deep trouble with the FEDS. Whats he going to do, gun down some of the most popular guys in Ohio?
Face it, if this was Alabama or Oklahoma you’d be ripping them a new one.
One more thing, I respected Jim as much as the other, but I also question his wanting to ‘protect’ the lawyer. Read all the emails, Coach Tressel barely writes 3 lines total in reply(one MONTHS later) and does not seem at all close enough with the lawyer enough to want to protect him to the length of committing a major violation. The only question he asked was NOT about confidentiality or the lawyers well being. In fact he asked for more information(specific names) which correct me if I’m wrong, a further confidentiality violation.
Sorry my tOSU friends …… Tressel needs to go.
His announcement to the media seemed insincere and full of excuses. Wasn’t this the same guy who gave an interview a few months ago and said “the buck stops here”. Everyone was praising him for being a “by the book” kind of a guy…… and a guy who always does the right thing. What a joke. Tressel knew what was going on and did not want to sacrafice the season by “outing” his players. It is pretty simple. The whole “buck stops here” stuff was just Tressel and tOSU trying to spin these infractions in a positive light. We now know that Tressel LIED to us and he knew about these issues long before anyone else ….. and did nothing about it. We also know that the President of tOSU also lied when he explained to us that the tOSU merchandise that was sold by these players was to support their families in a time of economic crisis. And last but least … we know that Pryor lied when he said that he “paid” for his tats. To quote a brilliant and epic man ….. Tressel and Gordon Gee are “turncoats, traitors, and trolls”. They both need to take a page out of Pete Carrolls rule book ….. and save tOSU any further embarrisment by resigning their positions (who knows …. maybe Rich Rod can be the next coach at tOSU). You can thank these two guys and a few of your star players for the circus that has become the tOSU football program. I thought I knew “who” Jim Tressel was ….. but, it appears that he has duped us all. This talk about him “caring” for the players and “doing the right thing” is all b.s …. This whole thing is a serious breach of trust and tOSU is handling it like it is a joke …… some meaningless “scrimage” games and the boosters will make sure that Tressel gets reimburssed the $250,000.
What a mess …… At this point ….. It is only fair to apply the same type of sanctions on tOSU as the NCAA did to USC. Lose the 2010 season, get scholorships taken away in future years, and no Bowl games for 2011 and 2012. If the NCAA deals with an “even hand” and punishes tOSU like they did USC …. then this encourage other coaches to “do the right thing” and not try to cover for their players.
“turncoats, traitors, and trolls”… Was that Charlie Sheen?
You mean, “the rockstar from mars”. …..
The one and only “train wreck” himself ……Charlie Sheen. I haven’t enjoyed watching any of his work since Platoon came out in the late 1980′s. But, he has become pretty entertaing over the last two weeks.
Here’s the problem which your premise. Tressel didn’t keep the matter confidential. He indicated in his press conference that he had forwarded the emails, so his claim is hollow at best. Further, this doesn’t excuse lying to the NCAA when they conducted their investigation in December, which will be by far the more dire allegation. In fact, he signed a statement saying that he knew of no violations before that point. You can’t say, well yes, I lied, but it was for everyone’s own good. The only permissible course of action would have been to (1) contact an OSU attorney, and (2) indicate to the NCAA that you cannot comment on the situation and let them talk to the attorney you just contacted. Tressel is acting stupid to try and state this defense, and lets be honest, we all know he’s smarter than this.
Tony, where have you been hiding. It seems to me that Oregon has some issues with the NCAA . I read the e-mails and there is nothing mentioned as to names, players numbers and etc. Besides Coach did not even know this idividual in the States Attorneys Office. You know how many quack e-mail he gets in a week,mothth etc. On the basis of a few e-mails your suppose to run to the AD and President with them. Get real people.
Carl …. There is nothing to the Oregon investigation. Every college football team uses scouting services. This was/is allowed within the NCAA rules and Oregon’s compliance department was consulted prior to us using them. The rules re: scouting services are somewhat vauge and probably needs to be more defined. Bottom line …. Texas and USC goy pissed off because we plucked a few blue chips from their own back yard. Nothing will come from this.
tOSu is a completely different story. To answer your question ….. based on the gravity of these emails and because these emails pertained to clear violations of NCAA rules …. YES, most definately Tressel should have run to the presidents office with this information. These emails were not from just any Quack pot fan. They were from an attorney that had shared information that he probably should not have. I hope that the attorney loses his job over all of this. The attorney didn’t care about “the kids” ….. he was turning over sensitive (and probably illegally) information in order to protect tOSU. Having Tressel instruct one of his players to not call the drug dealers cell phone because it will be turned into states evidence is tampering (did Tressel participate in tampering with evidence in a Federal drug investigation?). The lies and deception that coach Tressel has shown throughout should give everyone pause. He is not the person that you thought he was. He lied to the NCAA ….. and lied to you. He is obviously a pretty skilled liar because we all bought it “hook, line, and sinker”. But, alas the light of truth shown brightly upon his deception.
I can forgive a few kids for their involvement of “tatgate”. Lets face it …. they are 20 years old and probably closer to being boys then men. Their complete lack of judgement at that age is somewhat normal. But, there is no excuse for Tressel’s actions and his lies and deception are 10 fold more severe than the youthful indescretions of some kids.
Don’t be blind sheep ….. Tressel tried to cover this up and lied about his knowledge of the situation to the NCAA. He then had a press conference and used the “holier than thou” / “the buck stops here” lies … deception … lies. We now know who you really are Jim Tressel ….. and it isn’t that pesron that you pretend to be (actions speak louder than words). There is a place for people like Tressel ……. in the same boat with Pete “the cheat” Carrol. Enjoy the company of “fine men” Tressel.
Talk about “blind sheep” Tony. In the case of Ohio State, we’re talking about a couple of kids trading their shoes for tattoos. I think the most any student received was around $1,000.
In the case of Oregon, we’re talking about $25,000 being given to an individual to steer an athlete’s decision to go to Oregon. The NCAA limitations on scouting reports is around 1/5 of that amount.
But you’re right, Tressel made a poor decision which I’m sure is 10 fold worse than Oregon paying people to persuade recruits to go play for the Ducks.
Not really the time to throw stones Tony.
Jim,
The decision to use this “scouting service” went through our compliance department. Other schools (i.e. Texas) have used the same guy…. and now their complaining because we plucked a blue chip player away from them who lived in their back yard. The fact that Texas came out and said that they didn’t like the “mentoring relationship” that this scout had developed with his recuits …… and they wouldn’t deal with him again. Wow, that tells me that THEY used to use this guy too! In 2003 Oregon tried to recruit Adrian Peterson (blue chip player) out of Texas. When oregon contacted Adrian’s High School and requested game film of him …. the school replied that they didn’t have any film ….. because this kid isn’t leaving the state of Texas. It has become almost impossible for “non traditional powerhouse” football programs to recruit on a national level. Hence where these scouting services come from. I am sure that nothing will come out of Oregon’s NCAA investigation. Oregon didn’t lie or try to cover up the fact that we used this scouting service….or even how much we paid the scout. The decision to pay the scout went through our compliance department and they felt that it was within the rules of the NCAA.
NOTHING TO SEE HERE FOLKS ….. JUST MOVE ALONG ….. KEEP MOVING PLEASE
gulfportcarl – and when the NCAA asked him about it in December, did it just slip his mind that he had gotten these emails? How about the players? The emails say that he would talk to them. If he did in fact bring it up with the players, did the players also just happen to forget that Tressel had spoken to them in April? Additionally, your scenario is diametrically at odds with the story Tressel himself gave, that he was so scared by the emails that he didn’t know what to do. So which is it, did he just overlook them, or did he take them to heart and just decide it was best not to tell anyone about them?
I have to say that after seeing the press conference in its entirety today that Gene Smith, Tress and Dr. Gee looked like bumbling idiots. They embarrassed me. They should have addressed the issue(s) at hand with brevity. It should have been noted that the allegations are/were being investigated and a course of action would be determined for both the short term and long term. Instead, Smith and Gee made it a time to heap way to much praise on Tressel during one of the most serious press conferences in the history of tOSU athletics. Attempts at humor fell on deaf ears. This was an ill-timed and poorly orchestrated press conference in the eyes of this scarlet and grey goggle-wearer.
Could Gene Smith thank the NCAA anymore? It nearly made me nauseas. I can actually begin to believe why people hate Ohio State so much. It sounded like Gene Smith thinks that he and the athletic department have such a strategic alliance and relationship with NCAA brass that they can beg for and be granted forgiveness at any moment.
I would imagine Tressel appeared sincere to many of the faithful. But to me, the senator looked and sounded like a scared political puppet.
And Dr. Gee? Really? The football coach is not as big as you and your comment about him dismissing you was ridiculous and embarrassing. It didn’t even elicit a chuckle which is what I’m sure is the response you were looking for. Bad form, Dr. Gee.
Everyone in here knows I love the Buckeyes. But as of today, I haven’t seen one national print or national TV outlet that has spared their vitriol for THE Ohio State University. As much as I want to believe that it’s not true, this is starting to smell really rank. Rome, ESPN, etc. is destroying the reputation of the University. Perhaps it is well deserved.
I’ve gone from wanting this story not to be true and defending Tressel to starting to see major cracks in the armor. So far, I’ve gathered that an ex-football player at OSU and now an attorney with an undistinguished career is the one that sent the “confidential” e-mails:
http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2011/03/09/tressel-attorney-ncaa-violations.html?sid=101
IF Federal investigators were not involved during this time and Tressel has no record of reaching out to his superiors or to University attorneys, I’m afraid this situation isn’t going to end well for Tressel and the entire Buckeye Nation. I’m sad to say that IF Tressel is further suspended by the NCAA and/or the University is forced to vacate wins in 2010 he may have coached his last game as the head coach at THE Ohio State University.
It’s not pretty what local and national writers are saying:
http://blog.971thefan.com/fanlockerroom/2011/03/heres_what_theyre_saying_about.html
As for that student writer from The Lantern? As painful as it is for me say it…ahem…he may represent more than just one current student’s viewpoint.
I hope I’m wrong. Go Bucks.
Well said Not Alan ……. Gee, Tressel, Pryor and whoever else is involved has made a mockery out of tOSU. I remember on this blog many of you were “patting yourselves on the back” because of the way tOSU had handled the situation back in December. Many were singing praises to Tressel and saying that the whole “tatgate” thing has only made tOSU stronger and better.
The long road to recovery is about to begin …… and tOSU should cut their losses and sever ties with Tressel. Remember ….”the Buck stops here”. I wouldn’t be surprised to find out that Tressel actually did bring this information to the administration and there was a collective agreement to sweep it under the carpet. This would explain why the University is standing behind thier man like they are. The penalties are a joke. But, we may never know the truth here ….. because we can’t trust Tressel as a “man of his word”. It is apparent that Tressel is a skilled liar and took us all for fools. Time for Tressel to go before he damages tOSU any further.
As I said below, there is nothing in the evidence presented that demonstrates an attempt to deceive or demonstrates fostering an environment of non-compliance. To say that there was a collective attempt to sweep this under the carpet is about as far fetched as it can get. There is absolutely nothing in the history of Ohio State in the last ten years to support such a statement. It is also not supported in the timeline of events (http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2011/03/10/tressel-timeline-is-lengthy.html?sid=101)
Investigations were well underway before both stories broke (Dec. and this time). The release was rushed because national media got wind of internal investigations — stories that may never have broken if Ohio State wasn’t already taking the proper steps to self regulate.
Tony, do you believe every e-mail you receive? I delete all of mine when it’s from someone I don’t know. Let me say again, Coach had no proof this person was an attorney, he didn’t know his name. That being the case, why would you believe what he is saying is true? I would have deleted it and treeted the e-mail and the sender as a quack. There was no names, uniform numbers nothing that could be construed as fact. If he made a mistake it was continueing to communicate with this idividual. Nice try, but I stand behind him and am in no way concerned with Coach Tressel as the Buckeye’s football coach. You haters can go f–k off.
GPC-Thats where a MAJOR problem lies. Tressel did know the attorney’ s name. Cicero was a player at OSU when Tress coaches their in the 80′s. And this guy is a bit of a scum bag.
Carl …. first off …..I am not a hater. You need to take the blinders off. Yes, major violations reported to the coach need to be investigated. Did you even read any of the emails? They were very specific and it would not be difficult for Tressel to verify this information (probably take less than 2 minutes). Tressel has/is doing great harm to tOSU and there is no “one person” larger than the University. Take your emotions out of the equasion and look at this situation with a fresh set of eyes.
Carl …. From the horses mouth (the attorney). He told Tressel that both Pryor and Posey were involved. here are your names and the espn article.
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6206052
gulfportcarl – you know there is writing under the redacted portions right? There are clearly names of players in the emails that have been blacked out. Further, deleting the emails would be a major violation (also, its not like you can ever get rid of them, they are covered under FOIA so if he had tried to destroy them he would have been a violation federal law). Coaches have an obligation to act on any and all information suggesting that a player might be ineligible. And once more, your scenario is the opposite of what Tressel himself has claimed to have occurred. He says he believed the emails and was scared by them. Additionally, the attorney was a former player and it sounds like they knew each other (which is a near certainty since it turns out the attorney has represented several players in legal matters under Tressel). I get that you really don’t want to believe all of this, and I’m not saying whether Tressel was right or wrong (both morally or NCAA wise), but you are just making stuff up now and closing your eyes as hard as you can isn’t going to make this go away.
What Tress did was obviously wrong with regards to the NCAA, but morally I still believe that he was doing the right thing for the kids. He knew the most important thing was to protect them and make sure no harm came to them despite the stupid things they did. He also knew that keeping them in school was the best thing for them…certainly better than throwing up his hands and booting them off the team.
I take exception to those who say he knew about all 5 of them from the beginning. There is nothing to show that he had more than 2 names early in the process.
It’s easy to say that the very first thing he should have done was report the information.. and that would have certainly covered his ass, but may or may not have been the best in the long run. Hind site is 20/20 and it’s always easy to point the finger and play “Monday Morning Quarterback”. His priorities were obviously not covering his butt.. and I, for one, appreciate that.
Now.. are these violations up there with recruiting violations? Hell no!!
Recruiting violations provide a competitive advantage in that they bring players to your school that ordinarily would not be there and that is a much more serious offense.
The $Cam Newton thing, is a much much bigger thing as is the USC crap that occurred under Carrol.
And Tony.. if as the stories suggest, Oregon (and a host of other schools) paid for not only scouting services, but the steering of players their way.. this also wits waaaay harder than covering up what a couple of kids did with their personal stuff.
I’m not tossing rocks right now.. but if I were you I’d put your rocks back in your pocket too.
Honestly I could give a shit less what folks outside think about the Buckeyes or Tress. I still want him in charge of my program.
Well said Dave.
At some point, the world needs to realize that there are priorities more important then the NCAA.
One this Ohio State has going for it is that their issue was self reported. My understanding is that Ohio State contacted the NCAA to report the violation, whereas the other cases, the NCAA approached the schools about the violations.
I look at it this way..
As a parent, if I get information that my kid is hanging around with a known drug dealer and possibly doing drugs.. how would I handle the situation?
I could do everything the law would like me to do and report the whole situation to the police and hope my kid survives the situation, or I could sit my kid down and handle it on my own.
I know how I would handle it.. and I believe how Tress would handle it.. How would you?
Nice Dave ….. so, in your world it is OK to break NCAA rules and cover up for these student athletes. Athletes that are getting full ride scholorships to the University.
Get real …… You can’t compare “parenting skills” to this situation. These aren’t Tressels children and he has an obligation to the University, the Alumni, the students, the NCAA, the parents, the fan, the haters ……. to do the right thing. He didn’t.
I believe it to be more of a parenting situation than you appear to believe and his first priority should be to the kids/players.. not the fans, the college, and most certainly not the NCAA.
Dave,
It could be said by a number of “outsiders” that you’ve been very sucsessful when it comes to fooling yourself, but that doesn’t mean someone with an un-biased opinion has to buy one iotta of this horse shit.
Recruiting violations are a competitive edge? Really? NOOO, tell me it ain’t so!
And here all this time, I was under the impression that keeping quite in compliance with a former Buckeye (the attorney) and covering for 5 of Tressell’s most talented and experienced players was a competitive ege. Man, the intelligence here is just so overwhelming. I need a beer.
ASM, do you have exray vision eyes. You are assuming there were names, but would bet this years pay that their was. This whole situation from start to finish is comparable to a minnow in the ocean. Everyone is assuming fact that are not in evidence.
Carl ….. you crack me up brother. If there was nothing to this story ….. why did tOSU even punish Tressel???
Dave, I have to disagree (from a purely pragmatic perspective) that these are no more severe than recruiting violations. The NCAA as an organization has no power. It depends on the voluntary compliance, disclosure and honesty of its member schools. As such, lying to the NCAA is by far and away the worst offense anyone can commit. In fact, one lawyer who regularly represents schools facing NCAA sanctions said that a 10.1 allegation for lying is the equivalent of “first degree murder.” If you look to recent precedent, the NCAA has come down hard on 10.1 violations (assistant at USC who lied about Reggie Bush benefits was slapped with a show cause; Dez Bryant lied about attending a BBQ, and was suspended a year, Bruce Pearl was suspended 8 games and will likely be fired). Unfortunately I think Tressel has gotten himself into a bind, and given that the NCAA took a lot of flack allowing the players to play in December, I’m not sure the NCAA is going cut him any slack or go out of its way to believe is overly altruistic story.
crap.. put it in the wrong spot and no editing
One this Ohio State has going for it is that their issue was self reported. My understanding is that Ohio State contacted the NCAA to report the violation, whereas the other cases, the NCAA approached the schools about the violations.
While I question whether Tressel was actually worried about the safety of his players or this is simply an post hoc rationalization for his actions, I agree with you 100%. There are situations where disregard for the rules may be the advisable course of action. However, it is nevertheless a disregard for the rules. A violation requires punishment, what we are arguing about is not whether he broke the rules, but whether the mitigating circumstances justify a reduction in punishment.
I also think you have sliced the self reporting incorrectly. OSU did not self report this until Yahoo threatened to break the story. They didn’t report in April when they were required to, they did not report in December when the NCAA asked directly whether they knew about this before hand. They waited till their hand was forced, and I don’t think the NCAA is going to view that as the type of voluntary disclosure that is required.
I don’t believe that is the correct timeline either. As I understand it, when the wonderful piece of journalism (LEAK) that Yahoo came out, OSU and the NCAA had already been working on a joint investigation of the matter for around a month.
In fact, I believe that the source of the Yahoo information was someone from inside either the NCAA or Ohio State who was involved or at least knew about the ongoing investivation.
Ok, so they reported sometime in February. Likely upon finding that they had a leak.
That still doesn’t address the most important point here. That Tressel lied to the NCAA in December. Are you honestly suggesting that OSU should be let off for lying, waiting 3 months and then saying “ohh ya, remember that statement I signed, completely false…but you know, I’m telling you now so we’re all good right?”
Nope.. not at all. There should be repercussions, and there have been/will be. I’m am simply saying that it’s certainly not something he should be fired over and some would have.. that the reasons why you break a rule should be considered when judgment time comes around.
Totally agree…firing would be an overkill at this point. But I don’t think the punishment can be less than what they gave Oklahoma State and Dez Bryant. I wouldn’t be surprised to see 2010 vacated and Tressel suspended for the year or at the very least 5 games with his players.
This of course doesn’t address whether the players lied to the NCAA during the investigation. I could also see those suspensions being extended.
The one thing that no one is talking about here, is the last too major violation cases have involved large money concerns (Championship game for Auburn and Newton, and the Sugar Bowl for OSU). In both of these cases bowls, sponsors, and conferences were lobbying hard for the players to be protected. OSU no longer has this luxury. No bowl or sponsors will be screaming for them to be protected, and I wouldn’t expect Delany take a stand for OSU after the criticism he took last time and considering OSU lied to him.
Time will tell.
I don’t see the suspensions of the players being affected. Nothing here really changes what they did.
I’m still more upset with the kids for putting Tress in this position than I am for his handling of it. Especially TP with all of his “this will make us stronger” crap he’s been tweeting. What would make the program stronger would be if the student athletes held up their end of the bargain and followed the rules a little better rather than acting like a bunch of spoiled kids.
The money issues aren’t going away. Money drives the NCAA bus. The only reason it has any teeth at all is the teeth that the sponsors give it. Without the money from the big bowls and the television contracts, the NCAA would likely shrivel up like the pool water was cold.
AB-moderate my post from last night and get it up here. Being in Denver I’ve only had access to the national media outlets and its not pretty. Not been online to listen to C-bus radio this morning. This is likely to get worse before it gets better. And for those of you thinking Tressel would weather the storm if the NCAA were to take away the 2010 season? I personally think he would step down seriously decreasing his book sales…
I hope I’m wrong. Go Bucks.
Tressel still haunted by 1996 shooting
By: Dennis Janson
CINCINNATI – Memories of Jermaine Hopkins’ death in a gang dispute in 1996 still haunt Jim Tressel. The Youngstown State star defensive end was shot in the head as he tried to quell a disturbance near campus. He was and always will be 21.
A long time friend of the Ohio State coach told me tonight that the incident and hope of heading off future tragedies led him to quickly comply with federal authorities’ requests to keep quiet about their investigation of a tattoo shop owner.
I’m told that Tressel was inclined to feel that playing along, even though Ohio State and the NCAA were technically entitled to know, would help take dangerous criminals off the street.
He naively thought a greater good was being served by his discretion. Naturally the Buckeyes’ coach is deeply troubled by this mar on his reputation.
I’m told that while he didn’t mention it Tuesday night to possibly mitigate the headlines, much more will eventually be revealed about the situation. At which time I’m assured, Jim Tressel will be proved to have done the right thing, if not in the correct manner.
Peep…can you post the link to that story?
Although I am not familiar with that story, it’s exactly along the lines of what I was suggesting in the post above.
At some point, there has to be an acknowledgement that there are forces larger than the NCAA at work.
There also has to be an acknowledgement that this was not a recruiting or pay for play situation. Five kids got mixed up with the wrong guy.
Dave mentioned how he would respond as a parent. Let me take it a step further. As a former teacher myself, I have seen students getting into a bad, dangerous situations. My first response was never, oh no…he’s breaking the rules. My first response was always a concern for the safety of the student. That concern directed my actions from there.
Rarely did my actions involve bringing in an enforcer to implement the rules (sometimes they did). Sometimes, harshly enforcing the rules through suspensions or other means could place the student in an even more dangerous situation.
As a teacher, you look at what’s best for the student. You pull your resources and make the appropriate decisions to manage the situation. Yes, Tressel may have needed to bring in outside help to manage this situation. Not because of potential NCAA violations but because he was getting in over his head.
Those of us on the outside can scream and yell and second guess all we want. All signs point to a situation where the intent was not to break the rules or protect the 2010 season. All signs point to a teacher concerned about the well being of his students.
http://www.kypost.com/dpps/sports/tressel-still-haunted-by-1996-shooting-_6152993
You understand that you argument is not only a logical nonstarter, but it very simply proves too much. First, if he was truly concerned about the safety of his players, why wouldn’t he have consulted an OSU attorney or Smith? You were teacher…if you learned a student of yours was involved in potentially dangerous activity, would you have simply sat on the information and hoped it went away, or would you have involved you principle, supervisor, or school counselor to try and figure out how to help. His conduct does little more than manifest a hope that the problem would resolve itself.
Second, if your argument is to be accepted, that he should be let off because he thought his violation of the rules was in the best interest of the players, it would render 10.1 superfluous. Not only does the rule not provide for “for the benefit of the player” as a defense to an ethical violation, but what would stop every coach from saying that he had to lie because if he didn’t it would harm the player. Could a coach claim that if the player was kicked off the team he would have to return to a crime ridden neighborhood, justifying disregard of the rules? What if a coach claimed that a suspension would cause the player not to graduate, thus causing him harm. You get the point. Such a ruling would essentially interpret 10.1 out of the rule book. I know your rebuttal is going to be “but the players were in danger.” What danger? There is no indication that Tressel ever looked beyond the emails to find out what the serverity of the situation was. Ya ya, a former player got killed. That’s tragic and unfortunate. But what, does Tressel get a pass for the rest of his career because he “knows” how devastating the drug culture can be? Further, wouldn’t this just create an incentive to have schools solicit “dangerous” people to provide their players with impermissible benefits so that they would take advantage of the new “Tressel defense.”
The point is, Tressel messed up. He concealed information from the NCAA, and knowingly lied. There is no worse offense in college athletics. That being said, I think through all of this he had the best interests of his players at heart, the only problem is, those interests just happen to conveniently match his interests in keeping them eligible. He is (or at least was) and gold standard in college coaching. However, he made a phenomenal mistake and will have to pay for it. It’s unfortunate, but trying to further rationalize the situation is counter productive.
As an aside, for the team that has reported the most violations of any team in the country over the last few years, what are the chances OSU emerges from an 8 month fine-tooth-combing of its athletic department without more violations?
I’m jut trying to put myself in his shoes. Tressel’s mistake was not seeking outside help (yes, the school counselor portion was left out of my above comment). However, there were students who I dealt with on a one and one basis depending on the situation. There are relationships and circumstances at hand which we do not know or understand.
My point is that there is an assumption among the critics that Tressel’s actions were an attempt to deceive or break the rules. I’m not convinced that this plays out in the story we’re seeing as presented in the emails or the timeline of events presented (http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2011/03/10/tressel-timeline-is-lengthy.html?sid=101).
The NCAA violations include an intent to deceive or creating an atmosphere of non-compliance and I don’t think either play out in this story. Yes, a fine tooth comb may bring out other problems but that is pure speculation. We could make the same speculation of any organization.
The same could be said of any and every institution for sure. However, I don’t think the most serious aspect of this case is his failure to report. It will be, as you mentioned, his lying to the NCAA in December, and even worse, if he instructed the players to also deceive the NCAA during their investigation. I get the impression that he simply let the situation get out of hand couldn’t figure out what to do once it was over his head.
Again, I think he thought he was doing the right thing. Well see if the NCAA thinks coaches are permitted to make those types of discretionary decisions.
I think we’ve reached a point of agreement. I think a closer look at the December investigation is crucial to the investigation. If he instructed his players to deceive then yes, I agree that he should face harsh penalties. At this point, I don’t think the evidence pans out.
I also think he thought he was doing the right thing. Intent is going to be the deciding factor in this decision (or at least it should be — can’t say I have a lot of faith in the NCAA).
(Can you believe an Ohio State fan and a Michigan fan have found common ground)
What can I say, its a crazy world out there.
Hey, not saying this should happen, but history doesn’t bode well for Tressel.
“Since 2006, the NCAA has sanctioned 27 schools for violating bylaw 10.1, which requires coaches and others to be truthful and forthcoming about possible NCAA violations. Of the 12 coaches involved, only one kept his job. The others either resigned or were fired by their schools.”
That’s the rub.. I don’t believe the NCAA doesn’t have the authority to remove a coach as they do with the players… Has to be the university..
Unless something else really bad comes out of this, I don’t believe Ohio State will fire him. And I don’t believe he will resign either.
It’s really no different than the speculation connected with your theory, Jim. You’re wanting to believe so badly your coach is innocent of any wrong doing, that your willing to sidestep any and/or all evidence to the contrary to buy time in his defense.
Ultimately, (and sadly) the truth will eventually come out and I’m afraid you’re not going to enjoy the end result.
Maybe it’s the sweater vest. I dunno, but I have a feeling this guy looks a lot more innocent than he is.
SPIN ….. SPIN …..SPIN.
Nothing spins a story like a dead kid.
I have a question: Did Tressel approached the players involved and ask them if the allegations were true? If so, what did Tressel do with information? What if the players denied the allegations? Did Tressel believe them? What if the players confessed to Tressel? Did he cover it up? I cannot take credit for this line of questioning…Mike and Mike brought it up on today’s show. Bottom line on this…Tressel did not do the right thing and he should be penalized…even more so that the players. I am Buckeye fan and was a big supporter of Tressel…not anymore…unless he comes clean…and I believe he has not!!!!
Most of your are judging Coach Tressel on his not informing the AD and President Gee of the e-mails and possible NCAA infractions. Coach tressel is not stupid he knew what he was doing. What and why are yet to be brought out, but someday will be brought to the surface. Jim and PB made a few good cases for his actions. Especially the part about putting his reputation on the line for his players. It’s not like there are recruiting violation or takeing money from boosters. It’s about 5 kids who sold their rings, jerseys and the like for a few bucks or a tat or two, and whether
knew about it beforehand. Big whoop.
Lies and deception ……. I guess it is okay for Tressel to lie to you Carl. As long as the lie makes you feel good.
At some point I had to get this off my chest
Here’s the reality of it for me folks:
This is all going to blow over.. and when all is said and done, we could possibly be under probation, lose some wins, be under sanctions, and possibly even have a new coach.
Is it going to remove the memories of a great season and beating Arkansas in the Sugar bowl?
Nope!
It is going to dampen my enthusiasm on September 3rd when we take the field again?
Nope!
It is going to make me feel worse about being a lifelong Buckeye fan?
Nope!
I will either be sitting in the shoe with 105,000 of my closest friends, or in my living room with a dozen of my even closer friends wearing my brand spanking new Braxton Miller jersey ready for a season of great football!!
We’ll still beat the SH!T out of Michigan and the world will be good.
Dave …… great points. tOSU’s reputation has taken a great hit and those responsible for tarnishing its image should do the right thing and move on. It is time to “protect the University” and “protect the game”. But, not protect the person. Clean house and start the new season fresh.
..never said I was ready to clean house…
I’ll be wearing that jersey and cheering my a$$ off regardless of who is wearing the headset.
I’d still rather it be Jim.
Will you have your blinders on? Yep!
Tony, For argument sake I will agree with you he lied. Again Big Woop, and it has nothing to do
with pleasing me or anyone else. In order for Jim Tressel to lie to the NCAA he must have had a good reason to. Like I said earlier he is no idiot, he knew there would be consequences for his actions, whend he decided to take the course of action that he did. I have no problem with that, I will not throw him undere the bus because of it. Unlike other people I will wait until everything is out in the open and only then will I will take my stance on this whole mess. Until then I stand with Coach and back him with my last breath. It’s called Loyalty, look it up in the dictionary. If the same thing happened at Oergon I would expect you to take the same stance for Coach Kelly.
Carl, you are making huge assumptions here. How do you know that Tressel had a “good reason” for his lies. How do you know that he knew that there would be consequences for his actions?
I can make a few assumptions too. Tressel brought these allegations to the University and they decided to sweep it under the rug. If these allegations came to light then tOSU would have lost quite a bit of money throughout the season. tOSU has been spinning the “looking out for the kids” angle throughout this entire mess. They even used the sympathy card by trying to tell us that these kids sold their stuff in order to help their families through these economically challenged times. We now know that this was not true. The lies just keep coming from Tressel and the administration. I don’t believe a word out of any of their mouths.
Loyalty?? No, if the same thing happened in Oregon then I would want the coach gone … like yesterday. There is no excuse for the outright lies to the NCAA. That is like stealing from your employer ….. should be instant termination.
I haven’t always agreed with you in the past Tony, but so far, I haven’t disagreed with one thing you’ve said about this entire issue.
In a way, I kind of feel sorry for OSU. They have a long standing tradition of fantastic football, a dedicated fan base and a history of producing great players.
This whole thing is very unfortunate for such a great program, but it is what it is, and judging from the actions and responses of the administration and Tressell, plus the evidence at hand, it doesn’t look good right now.
Gonzohog …… I completely agree. Jim Tressel and the some of the current stars of tOSU are doing great harm to the tradition and history of their school. I am perplexed why there are so many apologists here. Call a spade … a spade. Cut your losses and move on. Jim Tressel broke a MAJOR NCAA violation. This …. “he did it for the kids” bull sh!t is nothing more than PR spin and more lies. There is NO excuse for what Jim did. Why do I feel like I am the only one sticking up for their university??? I feel as though the tOSU alumni should be the one carrying this torch and defending its tradition. Ironic…..
I (to kind of quote a epic and brilliant man) “love my University violently” and would never apologize for a coach or player that lied to NCAA investigators. If you can’t trust a mans word ….. what about him can you trust. If Jim came out in the beginning and confessed that he sat on this information …. then this whole firestorm would not be where its at right now.
Tony, comes along acting like Mr. Clean, but if the rolls were reversed he would be backing Chip Kelly to the hilt. Tony stop the bull shit please.
Soryy I spelled roles wrong.
Carl, we’re used to your mistakes. Just keep it rolling.
We are discussing bigger issues than spelling skillz right now….. and Carl ….. you are wrong. If Chip Kelly knew that any of our players were breaking major NCAA rules and just sat on the information … I would be very upset. If he turned around and then Lied to the NCAA during their investigation …. I would be livid. I want to trust that my coach has the kids and the universities best interest at heart. I don’t believe that Jim Tressel does.
I know what its like to be a parent and make tough decisions ….. I have had people come into my home at 3 am in the morning and wisk a child into rehab. I have called the police and reported my child as a runnaway when they broke restriction. I have had to do many things that were not fun …… but, they were in the best interest of my child. Jim Tressel didn’t do the right thing. He sat on the information and lied to investigators. What kind of example does this teach the young men at tOSU? More lies will come out about this. I am certain that the NCAA asked these football players if any of the coaching staff was aware of the violations. If any of them would have said yes ….. then this whole Tressel mess would have been dealt with in December. But, it is painfully obvious that the players lied to the investigators and then the tOSU administration soon came out with a statement that said they were not aware that violations were occuring. I can’t really fault the football players for doing this ….. because this is what coach Jim Tressel taught them to do. Jims actions taught them that it is okay to cover for each other and then lie to the NCAA. It was only when Yahoo threatened to break with this latest story about Tressel that the truth comes out. I hold Jim Tressel to a much higher standard than I do the 20 year old football players. Nobody really knows why he sat on the information ….. and we really can’t believe the PR SPIN that he is trying to put on it. The one thing that we know for sure is …. we can’t trust anything that he says. Go back and watch some of his press conferences from December. He fooled us all ….. and was very good at it. He took this terrible situation and made himself look like a champion. “The buck stops here” …. lol what a joke. All I can say is that he is a very skillful liar.
Carl, you can put me on record …..
Basketball anyone?
Yes. Jim, make about three or four basketball related posts so we’re not diluted with outsider bias.
How about some insider non-bias for a change? All of this patting Jim Tressell on the ass for “just looking out for his kids” garbage is about to make me throw up.
Some of you OSU fans obviously feel enough guilt to come over and explain/defend yourself about your university’s situation on Razorback message boards, otherwise, why try and explain anything?
The very best and un-biased opinions always come from the outside people looking in.
You’re in over your heads on this one.
Gonzo-certainly you can’t say that about me. If you’ve read my posts I think we’re in deep sh!t.
Have I done that? No.
GFY, troll.
Troll,…..wow, so original.
I see the basketball post went really well. There were an amazing 3 comments posted. Awesome. And such a good basketball team too. What a shame.
Give it a break.
There’s a lot more to the success of a blog post then the number of trolls I can attract to extend the comment thread.
It isn’t the number of trolls that’s relevent, good sir. In this particular case, it’s the number of trolls that never should have been here.
Think about that the next time you brag about how squeaky clean your “man of integrity” is and how great the Ohio St. football program is with all of their “self-reported” incidents.
O.K. You want to talk about problem programs. Let’s take a look at Bobby Petrino and Arkansas for a moment. It doesn’t take much of a Google search to learn about Petrino.
You can use this for starters: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=forde_pat&id=3151061&sportCat=ncf
But why go back when he just this month he helped Arkansas make the news: http://blogs.courier-journal.com/rickbozich/2011/03/03/petrino-and-players-with-criminal-records/
The difference between Ohio State’s seven players on the list and Arkansas’ 18? Tressel will help these kids get back on the right track and get their degrees. Petrino will just jump ship and leave the next coach to clean up the mess. Just ask the Louisville fans how that works.
Unlike Arkansas, our biggest problem is a couple of kids who got tattoos from the wrong shop. The reason we have a high number of self-reported incidents (all of which were minor offenses until this) is because Ohio State vigilantly polices themselves and does keep a clean program. Petrino, he just likes recruiting criminals and jumping ship.
Come back to me when your team is clean enough to call names. Until then, we’ve all heard enough.
Actually, you just got me started with your ignorance. Are those two idiotic links the best you can do for proof of whatever you’re babbling about? Good greif,…..please.
For starters, Pat Forde has an agenda against Petrino, and no other member of the national media, NONE, has bashed Petrino so harshly as Forde has in his quest to make a story over nothing.
One of the stories Forde claims to be true is how undisiplined the Louisville players were after Petrino left,. which is nothing short of a lie, considering the idiot head coach Louisville hired to preseed Petrino was looking for a scapgoat to put all of his own shortcomings on.
As for the criminal record being so high, A.D. Jeff Long just recently made a statement regarding these so-called criminal offenses.
The stats were obviously over-inflated to make a more interesting story, otherwise, I don’t believe DUIs and possession of a joint classify as being “criminals” in this day and age. Those are offenses almost every single college student either gets by with or just simply doesn’t get caught doing.
Oh and by the way, genius, how do you know these kids were commiting these so-called crimes when Petrino was recruiting them? Was it Pat Forde that told you or was it Barney Fife?
You know what Jim? I’m drinking a cold one right now in front of my computer. In just a short while, I’ll be on my way to visit my two grandsons. Man, I sure hope I don’t get caught in the process. I’d sure hate to be contributing to someone’s “criminal” shit list. (lols!)
So if you don’t get caught, it’s not a crime?
Oh yea I forgot…SEC.
Oh, I see. It’s only a bias when it’s against your school.
There’s no opinion in the Sports Illustrated article (If I didn’t link directly to the article, click through to the source). It’s a fact. Arkansas under Patrino leads the nation in players with criminal records. From your comments here, apparently the severity of the crime doesn’t matter — it’s still a crime.
I know about Patrino in Louisville because my in-laws, who live in Louisville, are (were) friends with Kragthorpe (he’s since relocated). Part of the reason he couldn’t get Louisville back on track is because he had to do such a major housecleaning when he took over for Patrino.
Don’t worry. Eventually you’ll feel the same way about Patrino that Louisville and Atlanta does.
In-laws my rear end. I’m quite sure Kragthorp told HIS side of the story too, not Petrino’s.
If Kragthorp couldn’t disipline Petrino’s players, that’s on him. Funny how no one can come up with any logical explination why Petrino never had disipline issues with these same players.
Kragthorp is nothing short of a turd, just looking for a scapgoat to lay his own shortcomings on. He isn’t half the disiplinarian Petrino is.
Don’t believe me? He’s cleaned up the football program Nutt left behind.
We had way more issues with the “criminal” element in our program and tranfers because of player unrest with the head coach when that idiot was still here.
These players have a lot of respect for Petrino, because they know if you don’t do it his way, you’re out the door.
It’s ok though, Jim. If you want to believe agenda-driven yahoos like Pat Forde and Kragthorp (because your in-laws say so) be my guest. I would expect as much from you.
A little defensive are we? Talk about rose colored glasses. The problem was that Petrino didn’t discipline his players because he didn’t care about their discipline problems. According to the statistics (ie. facts) in the Sports Illustrated report, he still doesn’t.
As for the discussion, time to move on. This is an Ohio State site and to be honest, Arkansas popped up on our radar for a short moment and that is all. Be glad you had the opportunity to get your buts kicked by us. Not many reach such heights. Also be proud of the fact that you were the first SEC team to lose to Ohio State.
Other than the fact that you keep trolling this website, our interest in Arkansas has pretty much passed.
GONZO… SO ORIGINAL
HOG…. SO ORIGINAL
AR-KANSAS… SO ORIGINAL
You want originality? Here you go:
Go drink what’s under your sink, slits your wrists vertically and choke yourself masturbating, you insufferable cunt.
You aren’t mad are you?
http://tinyurl.com/32v5vfg
I assume Jim is on this already.. But for those who haven’t looked away from the tourney tonight. Looks like the coach has asked that his suspension match that of the players.
http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2011/03/17/0317-ncaa-hands-down-decision-on-ohio-state.html?sid=101